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Discussion Starter #1
Erik Buell has announced that the factory team rumored for FX is not going to happen. A long search for sponsors has come up empty handed. Erik stated that he believed having the Daytona 200 as an FX race would bring the sponsors in, but he has found no interest from potential funding sources, and so has given up trying to put together a team for '05. Harley, the mother company, will not foot the whole bill. I see this as a tragedy. I also see it as worrisome for other teams and car and motorcycle racing in general. Even F1 is running out of sponsors.
 

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Beati pacifici
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WTF?

Because a fourth rate manufacturer (who is selling bikes at a loss, btw--check your local Buell dealership for details) is not getting sponsorship for non-podium finishing more than twice the displacement of the competitor bikes for a class that gets little airplay, you see the demise of motorcycle and cage racing?

As an example, MotoGP teams have sponsorship coming out their collective ass. Check the viewership for MotoGP...

What's in that coffee you've been drinking?
 

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Enthalpy said:
WTF?

Because a fourth rate manufacturer (who is selling bikes at a loss, btw--check your local Buell dealership for details) is not getting sponsorship for non-podium finishing more than twice the displacement of the competitor bikes for a class that gets little airplay, you see the demise of motorcycle and cage racing?

As an example, MotoGP teams have sponsorship coming out their collective ass. Check the viewership for MotoGP...

What's in that coffee you've been drinking?
+1
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Well, as a long time fan of F1, I can tell you that things aren't so rosey there. The fields are rapidly getting smaller, and the management is now in crisis mode. They are racking their brains to come up with anything and everything to make the racing cheaper, and they seriously feel that they may be facing losing many of their teams. In this country, the same problem is faced by the two Indycar leagues, even though both are far cheaper to run than F1. Only Nascrap has all the sponsers it can handle, though I find it the most boring racing on the planet.

Even MotoGP isn't as good as you say, that is, unless you are a Honda or Yamaha fan. The thing is, sponsers want to back a winner, and they flock to the winning teams, so the team that already had the most money gets more. Ask the backmarker teams if they have enough sponsership money, they will laugh in your face. The teams on the back rows can't interest big sponsers because they are on the back rows, and they will stay there because they don't have the money to get to the front.

Take a look at Kawasaki. Here is a factory team that's pretty much in the same boat as Buell. The parent company, KHI, has tightened the purse strings in recent years, and it shows. They have looked about as good in MotoGP as the Harley VR did in AMA racing. Now, if they could find a big sponser to make up the difference, don't you think they'd jump on it with both feet? Check out some race reruns and see how many sponser decals you see on the Kawis. What I see is a lot of green fairing. Open your eyes, man! Maybe you need a little of this coffee!
 

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Enthalpy said:

As an example, MotoGP teams have sponsorship coming out their collective ass. Check the viewership for MotoGP...

What's in that coffee you've been drinking?
Sponsorship coming out their collective ass? Then why are Kawasaki and Suzuki funding their own teams? Why didn't D'Antin have a sponsor last year? Why is team KR, now that they have a chance at a competitive motor, thinking about folding ? I'll tell you why, because there arn't enough sponsors in motor racing, and especially motorcycle racing. I think you need to adjust your coffee levels yourself.
 

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Beati pacifici
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There are plenty of sponsors in moto racing.

Wanting sponsorship is another matter.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Hal's Performance Cycles has announced they will be at Daytona with a Buell, and with Mike Cicotto riding. However, this is just a shoestring effort, with no chance against the Honda factory steamroller. Things could have been much different with Harley's support.
 

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Has any Harley based motorcycle ever raced successfully against the Japanese and Italian bikes? I know that the AMA likes to give HD special rules to help their antique motor, But I don't remember it ever saving the day in roadracing.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
In fact a Buell won the Loudon National two years back with Eric Woods riding. This was not an AMA race, but it was against a field of Ducatis and Japanese bikes.
 

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JMS said:
Has any Harley based motorcycle ever raced successfully against the Japanese and Italian bikes? I know that the AMA likes to give HD special rules to help their antique motor, But I don't remember it ever saving the day in roadracing.
Lucifer's Hammer. When Battle of the Twins was still an AMA series(BMW's, Ducati, RS750 motored Hondas, etc) Lucifer's Hammer was a Harley dealer project that Jay Springsteen used to win a Daytona race.

Harley Davidson won a 350cc, and 3 250cc world road racing championship in the 70's. 1974-1976
 

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XLCR said:
In fact a Buell won the Loudon National two years back with Eric Woods riding. This was not an AMA race, but it was against a field of Ducatis and Japanese bikes.
Didn't know that. As far as HD winning championships, I do remember those bikes and I think they were Italian made.
BTW, the XLCR is the only Harley that I ever wanted. Pretty cool!
 

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I'm so vain, I probably think this song is about m
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XLCR said:
Things could have been much different with Harley's support.
:laughing

your pipe dreams crack me up...
 

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Apoc...dude...do you race? He's spot on. I don't think they would have beaten Honda, but they would have put up a FAR better fight. I mean, it's a 1200cc engine. You know as much as I do with almost unlimited mods one can do you'll end up cranking out some good hp, even if it is ancient technology. Plus, the Buell is a sweet handling bike, I don't think anyone is going to deny that.

I personally don't get the hate for Harley here. I was excited to hear that there might be a good effort from the only American manufacturer out there. It makes for exciting racing. How many of you have been to a FUSA race when thunderbike was being run? It's a pretty awsome experience. Now we're back to the Honda fest. :rolleyes
 

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Clay wrote: "I personally don't get the hate for Harley here"
I don't hate Harleys. They are what they are, which isn't what I'm interested in. What I do have a problem with many HD riders with their strange attitude about their bike versus other motorcycle riders and bikes.:confused :redflip
 

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JMS, I don't think this racing effort has anything to do with your every day Harley crowd. I don't even associate Buell with those folks. I personally have no desire to step foot on a Harley myself, but having one less effort in racing is bad for us all. The only chance for them to compete is in FX, so I hate seeing them not doing so. :(
 

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you got me wrong dude... all i mean is that without time and development, they wont be competitive :shrug

You cant expect a buell with no race data at all to do well against bikes from honda/suzuki that have been developed over time with massive amounts of R&D and money pumped into them.

Development takes time...
 

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I expect them to be competitive, just not capable of beating Honda. It's just that I'd like to see MORE get involved. I don't believe Buell (Harley) can ever truly compete until they finally start producing today's technology. They basically need to work off the VROD engine, but make it lighter and more race worthy. That's what I think anyways. They've got the ability, just not the desire :shrug

I'm still sad to see them pull out. I think it would have been great to watch a true American team challenge for regular top 5 spots (like I think they COULD have been capable of).
 

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Clay said:
I expect them to be competitive, just not capable of beating Honda. It's just that I'd like to see MORE get involved. I don't believe Buell (Harley) can ever truly compete until they finally start producing today's technology. They basically need to work off the VROD engine, but make it lighter and more race worthy. That's what I think anyways. They've got the ability, just not the desire :shrug


Bingo. HD really has noe desire to support racing liek the other companies do. They had a good thing in 94 with the VR1000 but just quit major support for it in 95. They got what they wanted out of the VR1000, the motor design is the base design for the VROD's motor.

Back to teh VR1000, they really missed out on a potential sales market (28-40) by not making this bike a US street legal version at a reasonable price.
 
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