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Discussion Starter #1
Long story made short.

Boss pays me by check. I go to cash the check AT HIS BANK.

Bank will only give me cash if I let them charge a $4.00 fee or if I have an account with them.

To my knowledge a bank has no authority under the Uniform Commercial Code to charge fees for cashing a check that is good and properly payable on their books.

The bank's legal department refuses to cite on what authority they can do this. They say I have to show them proof that they can't do it.

Without researching the UCC, I know that cashing a check and paying it is part of the duty of dealing with commercial paper. No fee is allowed for doing that duty as it is the duty of the bank when presented with a check for payment that is properly payable, but I don't know what UCC citation that would be off the top of my head.

Likewise, I do not know if any such change to the UCC has since been made allowing such an outrageous practice to be done.

Any help? I'm going to see what I can find, but I have other work I need to take care of. UCC statutes specific to Virginia would be best, but since most states accept the UCC as generally published, any citation would help.
 

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I think it's more of a charge for using their teller, and since you're not their customer....
And I've seen signs at my bank that they have a charge for it as well.
 

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Geez, pay the $4 and get on with your life....:rolleyes

Oh and have a Merry Christmas...:redflip
 

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:crackup :crackup
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Guys, this isn't funny.

Your check is to pay the payee the full amount owed to him. If banks can get away with assessing fees for the payee wanting the amount in CASH (legal tender in all 50 states), where is it going to lead?

It is the legal duty of the bank to honor the check. Last I checked, they had no say in HOW they honor it....so long as it is usual and customary.
 

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Well, on the few occasions that I've actually cashed (as opposed to depositing) a payroll check in the last few years, not only have I had to pay a fee but I've also had to provide my thumbprint (I think I heard black helicopters hovering outside at the time). This was at the bank the check was issued from, while my account was at a different bank. I think it (the fee/thumbprint) is pretty standard these days.

Like someone else said...just pay the $4 and get on with your life. Then do the research and if you're correct, file a multi-million dollar lawsuit.
 

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http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/03/17/MNGEQ5MBL01.DTL

More info above. It seems that the ones I've posted are related to a Cali labor code. This article also mentions a finding of the OCC related to these fees.

The OCC is the heinous agency in DC that has allowed credit card companies to begin charging outrageous fees and jacking your interest rates around. I saw a documentary on PBS about the OCC...they're a bunch of scumbags that are pretty much Bo-Bos for banks and CC companies.
 

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Actually Tex, I agree with BG on this...it's not funny. Unfortunately there's little that can be done about it. It may seem like "only $4"...and that's true if it's just a one-time thing. But more important than the $4 is the principle of it as well as the precedent we're allowing to be set.

As I wrote above...there was an excellent documentary on PBS about the fees that CC companies are charging and how the OCC allows them to do so. Let me give you an example of the BS they're allowed to pull:

Let's say you've got a really good interest rate on your VISA card. You go to BestBuy and purchase a $5000 plasma TV on it. A couple of months go by, and you're out of town on vacation and forget to pay your VISA bill before you go. Not only is the CC company allowed to jack up your interest rate to pretty much whatever they want (and that's no joke...they had people who'd had their rates increased to like 20%), that increase is retroactive. So you bought your TV at (let's say) 2%...the CC company jacked your rate up to 20%...and you now have to pay that new interest rate on the TV you bought earlier. Imagine getting a home loan at 5%, then having it increased to 18% because you were a week late with your mortgage payment.
 

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Ride22West said:
Actually Tex, I agree with BG on this...it's not funny. Unfortunately there's little that can be done about it. It may seem like "only $4"...and that's true if it's just a one-time thing. But more important than the $4 is the principle of it as well as the precedent we're allowing to be set.

As I wrote above...there was an excellent documentary on PBS about the fees that CC companies are charging and how the OCC allows them to do so. Let me give you an example of the BS they're allowed to pull:

Let's say you've got a really good interest rate on your VISA card. You go to BestBuy and purchase a $5000 plasma TV on it. A couple of months go by, and you're out of town on vacation and forget to pay your VISA bill before you go. Not only is the CC company allowed to jack up your interest rate to pretty much whatever they want (and that's no joke...they had people who'd had their rates increased to like 20%), that increase is retroactive. So you bought your TV at (let's say) 2%...the CC company jacked your rate up to 20%...and you now have to pay that new interest rate on the TV you bought earlier. Imagine getting a home loan at 5%, then having it increased to 18% because you were a week late with your mortgage payment.
the solution to this is simple....pay your bill on time :shrug

credit is not a right, and neither is a good interest rate.

as for BG's problem, what about cashing the check at YOUR bank? no fees then.
 

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Iceman, I totally agree with you about paying on-time. But you have to admit that there are times when mistakes are made. What this documentary showed was that banks and CC companies have become virtually predatory. Rather than their fees being a penalty, they've become a source of revenue. The percentage of growth in both the amount of the fees and the revenue being generated by them was really shocking. There was one case (Providian) where the company was depositing payments (payments that were made on-time), but not crediting accounts. The result: they were not only getting their money but also charging late payment fees and increasing interest rates.

And I'm sorry, but an interest rate hike that applies retroactively is just unethical.
 

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The PBS documentary I was talking about is a Frontline special. You can actually view it online here:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/credit/view/

This is definitely not for those of you who can't read more than 5 lines in a post. But IMO it's very much worth the 50 minutes or so that it runs. You'll learn some interesting things, as well as see some bankers, credit card company flacks and government trolls try to defend some really sleazy practices.
 

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theicemancometh said:
the solution to this is simple....pay your bill on time :shrug

credit is not a right, and neither is a good interest rate.

as for BG's problem, what about cashing the check at YOUR bank? no fees then.
Thats more along the lines of what I was thinking...
But wait, "the man " runs the banks, so BG will have nothing to do with having an account...:laughing
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Well, I found the relevant VA law. Thank's for the help.

The law only allows a bank to not honor a check if there are insufficient funds, the person presenting the check does not comply with reasonable ID procedures (so they know it's really you endorsing the check), and there is a vague statement about non-compliance with the contractual provisions between the bank and its customers.

This involves Wachovia bank.

They did show me a section that has been put into all business accounts authorizing them to charge a fee for payment of presented checks...including payroll checks. My boss either agreed to this term or it was added in later and he never thought twice about the notice they sent him.

Legally, they are on thin ice. There is nothing reasonable to support the charge of the fee because they cite "risk" as the chief reason. Um, they have the account. At the press of a button, they know if there are funds or not. They can verify my ID (with thumbprint on the check) when I go to cash it. I know FOR A FACT that they did not do this last week (even though the policy was in place for over a year (their claim). I also know other people have cashed check my boss gave them with no hassles.

I figure they remember me from last week when I told them I only wanted to cash the check and had no interest in opening an account. Then, they blacklisted me. Otherwise, they would have politely turned me down last week.

I will file a complaint with the state corporation commission which regulates banks in Virginia. :mad

This is really BS because they have no risk in this matter....not any risk that a $4 fee will compensate for. It's just a way to (1) discourage people from dealing in cash, and (2) pushing people to open an account they don't want if they want to be able to cash their paycheck at the bank "around the corner" from where they work. :mad :mad

Again, thanks for the help.
 

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Baby Gorilla said:
Well, I found the relevant VA law. Thank's for the help.

The law only allows a bank to not honor a check if there are insufficient funds, the person presenting the check does not comply with reasonable ID procedures (so they know it's really you endorsing the check), and there is a vague statement about non-compliance with the contractual provisions between the bank and its customers.

This involves Wachovia bank.

They did show me a section that has been put into all business accounts authorizing them to charge a fee for payment of presented checks...including payroll checks. My boss either agreed to this term or it was added in later and he never thought twice about the notice they sent him.

Legally, they are on thin ice. There is nothing reasonable to support the charge of the fee because they cite "risk" as the chief reason. Um, they have the account. At the press of a button, they know if there are funds or not. They can verify my ID (with thumbprint on the check) when I go to cash it. I know FOR A FACT that they did not do this last week (even though the policy was in place for over a year (their claim). I also know other people have cashed check my boss gave them with no hassles.

I figure they remember me from last week when I told them I only wanted to cash the check and had no interest in opening an account. Then, they blacklisted me. Otherwise, they would have politely turned me down last week.

I will file a complaint with the state corporation commission which regulates banks in Virginia. :mad

This is really BS because they have no risk in this matter....not any risk that a $4 fee will compensate for. It's just a way to (1) discourage people from dealing in cash, and (2) pushing people to open an account they don't want if they want to be able to cash their paycheck at the bank "around the corner" from where they work. :mad :mad

Again, thanks for the help.

what really happened here is this;
George Dubya Bush reads your posts, and is offended by the way you portray him. he then decides to get the last laugh by blacklisting you from every bank in the country. his thinking is that if he can keep you from getting money, you will lose your internet connection, and then you cant tell us all about his plans to dominate the world.:crackup
 

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texmex1 said:
You're wrong, this is very funny....:crackup :crackup

no, its not, its the principle of the matter.
 

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ziadel said:
no, its not, its the principle of the matter.
No, really, it is ..... :crackup

Oh yeah, Happy Birthday:redflip
 
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