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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I wanted to this to be away from the sexy poses and the men who don't like them discussion, because it goes so far beyond that. It applies to the crusades, to the middle east, to assholes burning down "black" churches, and women I'll never meet cutting mean looks at me because they think I'm going to snub them.

Your standards belong to you, as you get older and learn lessons that are exclusively yours, you'll find your standards are sculpted by those experiences.

We may all learn that fire burns and broken glass can cut us, but the more esoteric stuff is different for all of us.

When we try to apply our standards to other people, it doesn't usually end well. When we try to force others to live up to our standards, it usually ends with us committing a terrible wrong against that person, even as we are trying to be right, or righteous.

Years of holy wars have proved nothing. War is not holy, and hurting people is not the hallmark of a person whose heart is in the right place.

Outside of moral absolutes like "murder is wrong" that grey area is where we all get to play, to discover who we are, and develop ourselves. It's my belief that this freedom of choice is given to us so that we may show God who we really are. You might believe it is spare time in which to make a snack. I have no place judging your beliefs, or the way in which you choose to live your life.

WHy does it seem so hard to understand? Why do entire nations just not get it? You can't force others to live by your standards. You can't measure someone elses worth or progress by your own moral beliefs. It doesn't work.

You can observe that someone's standards are incompatible with yours, but that isn't a value judgement, it's just a way of making it through this world with companions we can get along with.

The attempt to force or coerce others to fall in line with our own beliefs is the cause of wars, murders, and hurt feelings.

How long is it going to take to figure it out?

You can be right for you, and wrong for me, and that's OK, nobody has to change. We don't all have to agree.

Sorry for the big long rant.
 

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well said, and very true...
this is truly wisdom from my neighbor...
 

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excessa, you are definitely one woman with her head on straight. Sadly, people will never learn to accept eachother and there will always be hatred and wars. Great post, and I'm glad it didn't get caught up with the rest of the senseless rhetoric in the other post.:thumb :hail
 

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although I dont always agree with others and their choices, I do agree that it is THEIR choice.

Nice post.
 

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My personal belief is that some people have such a high opinion of themselves that they think anyone who disagrees with them is somehow deficient. I think it's born out of snobbery. I am better than you, you need my teachings to better yourself, so that one day you may aspire to be of my superior calibre.

Socrates said the only path to true knowledge is to first acknowledge that you know nothing. I firmly believe that...it's those people who think they know everything that are frequently the biggest idiots.
 

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Sean said:
My personal belief is that some people have such a high opinion of themselves that they think anyone who disagrees with them is somehow deficient. I think it's born out of snobbery. I am better than you, you need my teachings to better yourself, so that one day you may aspire to be of my superior calibre.

Socrates said the only path to true knowledge is to first acknowledge that you know nothing. I firmly believe that...it's those people who think they know everything that are frequently the biggest idiots.
as children we were all so open and willing to learn. I know I wanted to learn about everything I could...it seems that some folks assume that being an adult means that you do, or should know everything. From what I can tell, learning is a big part of what life is all about. IMHO the second you stop wanting to become more intelligent you have become less intelligent.
 

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lightner22 said:
IMHO the second you stop wanting to become more intelligent you have become less intelligent.
People who think they know everything are the idiots. To be right, you must first be willing to admit that you have been wrong. Like Edison said, I have not failed, I have discovered 500 things that do not work. That's the path to true knowlege.

When people are confronted with things they don't understand or that intimidate them, it interferes with their belief that they know everything and have all their shit together. So they seek to destroy it, to keep their perception of their reality and of themselves intact.
 

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Hmmmmmmm.................:confused





















Yep! I'm Lost.:redflip
 

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BABETTE said:
Have you no thoughts........errr........to post? :rofl
Well, I think excessa has way to much insight on this whole deal.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I think it's very easy to fall into the trap of thinking we're smarter than someone else. I find it a good perspective tool to get to know the person better, paying special attention to the skills they have that I don't possess, or experiences they've had that I haven't.

It always brings it home for me. I might be well versed in one area, but lacking in another.

It's an "I'm a good writer, but I suck at math" kind of thing, for me.
 

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excessa said:
I think it's very easy to fall into the trap of thinking we're smarter than someone else. I find it a good perspective tool to get to know the person better, paying special attention to the skills they have that I don't possess, or experiences they've had that I haven't.

It always brings it home for me. I might be well versed in one area, but lacking in another.

It's an "I'm a good writer, but I suck at math" kind of thing, for me.
Where are we going with this babe....:confused
 

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A thought provoking post indeed.

Unfortunately, in a society when you have views that are incompatible, sometimes they cannot exist peacefully side-by-side because one has a direct and negative impact upon the quality of life of the other. As is exhibited time and time again on this message board there are times that agreeing to disagree is not possible.

I believe it is in those times of conflict and during the passion of those battles that we truly display our humanity or inhumanity towards others and get to show God who we really are, sometimes for good and sometimes for bad. I don’t believe it is possible for us to live conflict free, but we sure can handle conflict in a much better manner than we do now.

I wish I had more time to work on this. Maybe later.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Hawk, I agree to the extent that I am unaware of any actual way to live conflict free.

However, I was trying to exclude moral absolutes, which definitely includes any habit or belief that causes harm to others.

It seems it would behoove us all to at least attempt to live side by suide without too much concern for whether the person next to us practices the same moral approach as we do, if for no other reason than to spare ourselves difficulty and spare them ill will toward us.
 

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I think most of this type of conflict derive from individuals seeking personal advantage regardless of the consequences to others. The advantage sought could be economic, political, etc... Isn't this the definition of immaturity? This selfish immaturity is ironic when wrapped in the cloth of religion. It's also usually a short-sighted way of thinking. No clue how to overcome this (other than better parenting), but it's frustrating as hell.
 

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Re: Re: Seperation of Standards

Hawk said:
A thought provoking post indeed.

Unfortunately, in a society when you have views that are incompatible, sometimes they cannot exist peacefully side-by-side because one has a direct and negative impact upon the quality of life of the other. As is exhibited time and time again on this message board there are times that agreeing to disagree is not possible.
true. we have to remember that some people's beliefs INCLUDE the idea that they should force their beliefs on others. while excessa's post is a wonderful ideal, it's completely unattainable in the practical world, except on an individual basis.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Hell, I can think it, but I doubt I can do it, because there are too many people that I think are total dumbasses.

But I can see the ideal as desirable.

If we all try a little harder to see each other as individuals with every right to choose our own path, maybe we can learn more and fight less and be happier in the long run.

Or maybe, as individuals, if we create less dischord around us, we'll find the world slowly *does* change, or at least our little part of it.
 

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Ex... why do you think I put up with Ed??? :redflip I learn something new about people EVERY DAMN DAY!!! :laughing

But you are so right--even if you just think before opening your mouth, it's a good plate to bring to the table. Thanks for bringing that up! :)
 
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